In our community, one thing we sometimes forget is that many technologies and machines that we take for granted are still close to black magic to many outsiders. Here's a tip: Next time you visit the hacker space with a group of visitors, let the 3D printer run and watch their reaction when a Benchy slowly emerges from the moving extruder. For us, this is part of the landscape, but for them, it is impossible futurism, and their thoughts are shocked.
Nearly 15 years after the launch of the RepRap project, we have seen tremendous progress in the functionality of affordable 3D printers, and now the relatively low triple-digit sum will ensure that a machine from China will produce early prints of amazing quality. By. In our community, we have reached the point where many people use their third or fourth printer, which has brought unexpected side effects. Once a hacker space may only have a very precious 3D printer, now it is not uncommon to find a bunch of redundant old printers on the shelf. I have a few hacker spaces. This is a scene I often see in other people's travels. Perhaps this is a sign of technological maturity, when it becomes e-waste, so affordable 3D printing seems to have matured.
You can learn a lot about the product through the use time of the product. For example, the percentage of Volkswagen Golf that survived 30 years is much higher than that of Yugo 55. Therefore, to look at these piles of old printers is to see which models are stars and which are lemons. There are several main lines, each of which represents a different set of failed dreams. First among them are the pioneers, Makerbot Cupcake or RepRap Darwin or Mendel. We even know that there is a working cupcake space, but these are not the machines you will use in 2019. On the contrary, they represent an era when 3D printing is still a new thing for us. If you think of the first machine you saw, maybe it will be here.
Then came the surprise. The decent workhorse of their era could still provide trustworthy results, but they were just bypassed. For example, it was shocking to see a bunch of Ultimakers idle earlier this year, but maybe I need to remind that it is not 2015 anymore.
By far the most numerous is the next group, counterfeits, which proves that just selling something as a Prusa clone does not make it a Prusa. Interestingly, although not all clones are of low quality, I can think of more than one clone of the Marriott replicator, the Makerbot Replicator, which is still happily used for many years.
Finally, in the hacker space, someone bought a delta printer and inevitably found that it had a problem. This is the norm. Is it eager to be different or just like printing the vase that drives it, but if I have to guess which printer will accumulate dust, it will be someone’s Delta project.
Therefore, we expose the typical hacker space garbage dump as a potted plant history of failed desktop 3D printing efforts, but this is both a major problem and an opportunity. One problem is that although 3D printers have become a waste problem, people still believe that 3D printers have value in themselves-but only when they do something instead of sitting on the garbage dump can realize the value. An opportunity because they still contain the basis of idle CNC machines.
If we can get rid of the sacred view of old 3D printers, then we can use them to make some things and turn them into the basis of other things. We sometimes accumulate piles of trash before we realize that we have made a mistake, so there is no shame in re-examining that pile of printers.
In the most basic case, a redundant 3D printer is a pile of parts waiting to be disassembled. Slide rails, stepping motors, extrusions and related electronic products. It is doubtful whether the cutting-edge technology of extruder and control panel can find use in 2019 around 2012, but the rest should find ready-made homes in other projects. However, dismantling the printer may overlook its main event. A ready-made CNC mechanism with a large number of X, Y, and Z axes and a ready-to-use controller should be something with unlimited possibilities.
Connecting a mini router or engraving laser to it is a completed transaction, but what else can you do? Use syringes and servo systems to make chocolate and fudge extruders and print candies? Attach an LED to some 3D light painting? Disposable art projects or quirky tools, how do you reuse abandoned printers to prevent them from accumulating dust.
No matter what you think about redundant 3D printers, there may be another story in all of this. Our community didn't invent a 3D printer, but we of course have treated it as our own and used it to run. If we have reached their ultimate maturity, then success belongs to us to some extent, to the hackers who pushed their designs. We can be proud of the pile of redundant old printers, because they and the $200 Chinese machine that replaced them represent 15 years of success in our community. The question is, where will they go in the next 15 years?
There are many people around who are happy to buy used ones for around $100...but a few sellers around seem to think that no matter how outdated it is, its value is around $300...despite the above, new things are now being sold The capacity is twice as much as $200.
Yes, second-hand printers need to have some special features in order to be higher than the part value. In particular, new printers can be purchased for functional products between US$89 and US$139 (special price). Let's face it, the potential workload may be the same as other people's problem second-hand items.
Wow, I haven't seen them so cheap, or those with 10 cm cubes that build the volume, I have been discounting them as "toy" models.
I think this may mean the lowest possible price, but the analogy still holds. Many of these printers are easily surpassed by new technologies, but people seem to think they retain their value. At least not true.
In many respects, the aging speed of ordinary printers is about twice that of ordinary computers, mainly due to its single-purpose nature. What was purchased at a "premium" price when brand new is now worth at most 1/4 of the original price...especially when compared to a relatively low-cost brand new system with the latest technology and full warranty.
Again, some of these people are the same people, and they expect the Star Trek Replicator to reach a perfect level, when in fact it is actually a machine that needs the same adjustments, maintenance and learning as any other complex tool curve.
It would be great if more people realized this, because these components are still the most useful, and there are still many things to use.
What are you talking about now? Give it to me, I would be happy to upgrade all these stepper motors!
Just wanted to say the same thing :)
I limit the number of wasted 3D printers by not having one. For this, I have several reasons:
1. I think the whole 3D printed thing is exaggerated. I don't like things that are overhyped. 2. Anything a 3D printer can do, a CNC milling machine can do it. The difference is that for the factory, it must be planned in advance how to manufacture and assemble parts to form the final product. There are also some work in the selection of milling heads, drills, engraving machines, etc. This involves more. 3. The types of materials that can be used with 3D printers are limited. CNC milling machines can process a variety of materials, including wood (I prefer), various plastics and metals. 4. The 3D printer is very slow. And it needs to be constantly observed to prevent problems. 5. Most people use them for the same things that can be made with hand tools or CNC milling machines.
I may have to wait another 15 years for the technology to mature...
I think part of the reason is that CNC milling machines tend to be more expensive and more complicated. I have never seen a hacker space with a row of CNC milling machines, but many have many printers. A CNC milling machine is an excellent tool, but only if you can access and use it.
In fact, in my opinion, based on my experience, CNC milling machines are not difficult to use. It is more complicated than 3D printing, but on the other hand, you can use a mill to handle things that 3D printing cannot achieve. Because you can use 3D printing for things that are very difficult and complex on the mill (and may involve many different tools, molds, castings, and other interesting things). You can get an entry-level CNC for about US$500. Some versions even have a real USB controller, which is both good and bad (it only works with Mach3 under Windows, so the open source crowd will not like it at all). There are cheaper machines that use aluminum extrusions, 3D printed Z-axis and spindle components, and cheap 775 DC motors as spindles, but they are almost useless-there is no rigidity, especially in components, which are stepper motors by default Insufficient power and too large microsteps. Just search for CNC 3020 which has a more rigid structure. Once the 300W spindle dies, I will add another $100-150 as the future cost of a more powerful spindle. Operating costs are just some lubrication, milling cutters and inventory.
An open source alternative is the MPCNC and GRBL controllers. I did use GRBL and it worked very well. The machine it controls OTOH is almost useless-it requires a lot of hacking...
I agree that 3D printing is overhyped and CNC milling machines are more powerful, but for ordinary people, I disagree that they are not difficult to use. Separate workpiece clamping is a big problem, and it usually requires designing and milling parts to hold the parts you ultimately want to manufacture. Planning/generating tool paths requires a lot of time and consideration, and if your workpiece is not a simple x/y contour shape, it can become extremely complicated. Then there is the chaos of chips, the cost of tools-it is easy for me to invest more in end mills than in my two 3D printers. End mills are constantly being replaced, and a new tool must be indicated between replacements to continue subsequent operations. Now, if you really want to cut metal, or even some plastics, you will need a lot of coolant, which requires very complicated housings, shielding of electronic devices/motors, etc.
I have a mill and two 3D printers (one FDM, one resin). I like the mill and use it more than a printer, but zero people I know devote time and resources to learning/using the mill instead of a 3D printer. They are just a completely different world of promise.
In the end, I think you are a bit digress. This article is about how to deal with outdated 3D printers. I agree with Colin's point of view-I will take measures! ! ! :)
– Agree – I will not put CNC on a similar level of difficulty (I have done both). There are more complications. Workpiece clamping, tool size to be considered (cutting radius and gap, and then crushing the chuck or other things into the work piece), feed rate (of course, 3D printers have these, but usually you can use the default values, and only if You are willing, please adjust). More intolerant-don't give enough consideration to feedrate, depth of cut or workpiece retention, you are likely to destroy (not cheap) things. FDM, you can almost model it by thinking about the support and printing methods, and then let it rip apart. I usually don't monitor prints closely, but even if you want, RPi on budget printers can provide you with wireless printing and monitor prints from your mobile device when needed (given USB or pi cam).
To be honest, I’m a bit cheating" 1. I screw the stock outside the work area onto the table. Usually this is enough. If I need to machine parts on a different side, I will cut a hole on the negative side of the new bottom and then Press in the part. Then I just zeroed the Z axis at the top of the inventory. 2. I have a limited number of tools, so I plan my work accordingly to make minimal tool changes. 3. Each new tool used is a separate job , So I don’t care about tool offsets, etc. Just wait for the job to complete, change the tool, reset the Z axis and load the new job. 4. For CAD and CAM, I use Fusion 360. IMHO, this is for this The best "free" software for class work. It has some quirks and problems, such as the entire "cloud" thing, every time I open a file I have previously processed, I need to regenerate the tool path, etc. Open source CAD software usually has bad Great user interface, bad user experience, sometimes the basic idea of making software is stupid and harder to use, arcane and evil.
As for the feedrate part, it's annoying, really. The available data is either for the most expensive tool (I can't even find it here, let alone affordable), or it is unreliable and imprecise. And everyone in the US still uses IPS instead of mm/min, which adds an extra conversion for me. I hate the empire system, it must die. In any case, I found some standard default values for the stocks I use, and it is still valid so far.
As for crashes, the problem usually lies between the computer and the chair. My first machine was weak, not hard enough, and it was usually a piece of rubbish, and the tools were always damaged in materials. It is usually good to use the tools I have now, and the workpiece or stock or the wooden block holding it will be damaged.
I need more end mills. A job yesterday took 1.5 hours because I have a too big end mill and a too small end mill. Fortunately, the cheap ones I can buy are enough for the material I am processing.
MPCNC is not open source.
Entry-level CNC 500 USD? In which world? ! PocketNC is considered entry-level, it is about 6000 US dollars or more after VAT and shipping costs, such as 6000 Euros. For 500US, you won't even get a working shaft DIY.
The machine next to my computer is different. I have if it is free, but paid less than 700 USD to my owner 4 years ago. Once I burned the original spindle, I spent another $130 to get a larger spindle. Just search for CNC 3020 on eBay or AliExpress and check it out for yourself.
As for Pocket NC, it is not an entry-level machine. It is more like a semi-professional machine, a 5-axis type that can process aluminum at a decent speed. Compared with a machining center whose cost is 10-50 times higher than that of Pocket NC, it is an entry-level...
I have a CNC3018. It is not about lack of power or rigidity. As I found out when I calculated and accidentally cut the metal fixture in the middle. Compression is a big problem, in addition to the simplest shape, calculating the cutting path is also a big problem. I believe that 3D printers can now handle a certain amount of overhangs, allowing very difficult shapes without a 5-axis CNC.
To be fair, you don't seem to be the target market for 3d printers, so you won't find them as useful as the cnc you mentioned, which makes sense. Each tool has its advantages and disadvantages. In many jobs, fdm is more meaningful than trying to delay work on cnc.
I did a lot of rapid prototyping. After using a 3D printer for 4 years, my workflow was dialed in. I could transform the design from a concept to a working prototype in just one or two hours (obviously for relative terms) Small mechanical components rely on complexity that does not require the lowest level of height).
Almost all the shortcomings of 3d printing you mentioned can be attributed to user error/misuse, and can easily affect novices who use cnc machines. Of course, it will be bad if you try to use a hammer as a screwdriver, but also trying to use a screwdriver as a hammer is not the best choice. Finally, use whatever tool you have that is best for the job.
agree. I have a 3D printer and a CNC milling machine. They are suitable for different things, and I am very happy to be able to use each of them for my expertise.
3D printing parts is much faster and easier than operating a factory manually or CNC, and requires much less knowledge and skills.
Slow is relative. Milling complex parts is also a slow process, and even CNC milling machines require a lot of user intervention. A 3D printer can be started and left alone for hours or days (if it is a well-made printer, like I made), and you can do other things. You don’t have to watch a well-made printer.
I have made and used 3D printers, and used manual and CNC milling machines. I can tell you that for most jobs, 3D printers are definitely faster and easier to use. I use the most suitable tool for the job, but in 80% of the cases, the 3D printer can produce enough parts for whatever I am doing.
I think if you try it, you will find it very easy to use and very practical. No, you won't make high-precision things or engine parts on it, but there is a lot of work that can be done and done well.
Fully agree to choose the best tool for each job, printing is usually sufficient, slow speed is relative-just because most cutting in the factory takes a few minutes, for each complex part, you may need to spend several Hours to reposition for the next cut. And spent a lot of extra time in part design to figure out how to make this complex geometry in multiple parts for later assembly. Use a good 3D printer to design the part (usually you don't need to care about its geometry at all), and then tell the machine to print.. It will be done when you come back tomorrow. With CNC, you still need to design parts, but due to the huge limitations of CNC milling machines, you eventually have to really spend time thinking about the manufacturing process, so this step takes longer...and then you have to complete all manual operations Set up for each cnc step.. Working hours CNC is always very bad (although it is often worth the time because the parts can be made with the best materials)!
As for the definition of accuracy, "high-precision" FDM machines can match or even exceed milling accuracy depends on many factors, such as the depth and width of features and the value of the machine (a very expensive and really good milling machine will be hard enough to cut without deflection force, But one that is comparable in price to a 3D printer will not be easy to achieve)... and UV curing resin can provide a stupid level of accuracy...
The biggest benefit of 3D printing is the crazy geometric shapes that CNC milling machines can never complete. The biggest benefit of CNC has nothing to do with forming shapes, but with more types of materials that can be processed.
This was my idea (at least a few) until I received my first filament printer. I now think they are better machines than CNC milling machines:
1. Reduce waste-Subtractive manufacturing will leave a lot of waste. 2. Don't make the sound too loud-you can operate the 3D printer without causing dissatisfaction from nearby residents. 3. The operation is less dangerous-the print head may burn your fingers, and the spindle may hurt it more. 4. It also takes time to wire in 2.5D using CNC gloves. You can't let it run without continuous observation.
I should start 3D printing earlier than I actually did.
1. Coming back from the grass, it's winter outside and it's very cold. 2. That's not true. Most things are certain, but not when you start to take advantage of the opportunities that technology brings. Big companies don't have a machine park. They are filled with multimillion-dollar printers just to giggle (well, I have worked with companies that do this, but it doesn't matter: D). 3. I will give you wood, which is a bit tricky. But plastics, composites, "rubber" (I bet, processing a piece of Shore 50A plastic is very tricky, especially when you need sub-millimeter details) and metal materials can all be used. 4. Slow is a relative term. When you plan, set up, and assemble the parts, the printer has been printing for a few days. Of course, if we are talking about a very simple part with few plans, CNC may win, but once things start to get complicated, that's another matter. If we are talking about the operation of many identical parts that the process is dialed in, CNC will have an advantage, but when we start talking about custom parts, things will change a bit. No, a high-quality printer does not need to be monitored like a CNC milling machine. 5. Lovers, of course.
In the final analysis, all this is just a tool. You can use any tool that is best for the job, in some cases a hammer, in other cases a scalpel. There is nothing wrong or right, just a sliding ratio of applicability and advantage. Many people suffer from the "good luck" syndrome as soon as they get the printer.
advertise. 1. I am 34 years old, what winter? ! The temperature here is 8 degrees Celsius! 3D printing is exaggerated. It used to be used only by large companies to make prototypes of products that will eventually be processed or molded (depending on the type of product and material). Now every company, every hobbyist and every start-up company is trying to use them as the main production tool, even if it doesn't make any sense. advertise. 2. Large companies can afford large and powerful 3D printers. They can also have machining centers and other tools beyond amateurs and even some semi-professionals. advertise. 3. Show me an entry-level 3D printer that can make metal. And I don't know how to machine semi-rigid materials-I will mill molds for them. advertise. 4. According to my experience, the slowest operation is always the most complicated, such as 3D engraving with a ball-end milling cutter. It may still be comparable to or faster than 3D printing. The only time wasting on an amateur mill is the setting, such as reversing the inventory to grind the other side. But this can also be solved by some smart thinking. I'm making a custom keyboard out of wood-in order to grind the bottom of the keys, I will grind a hole for them in a piece of inventory, then put them one at a time, and then run to finish the work. advertise. 5. Most HaD readers are amateurs.
Regarding the last point, I agree with you. A 3D printer is just a tool, useful in some situations, but it cannot replace all other tools, especially when we are talking about entry-level, hobbyist machines. However, people try to 3D print almost anything, even if it makes no sense from an engineering (or economic) point of view.
> *Now every company, every enthusiast, every start-up company is making every effort to use them as the main production tool*
That is crazy exaggeration. Yes, some people overuse it, especially those who have never actually used 3D printing and just heard of it, but its limitations are well known.
#3 – Show me a metal-supported grinder. It does not require various upgrades in motors, guide rails, stiffeners, etc. The cost of using tools is less than 10 times that of entry-level 3D printers. You can't, just like no one can show you an entry-level 3D printer that can process metal. This question is ridiculous.
I have a Taig CNC milling machine, which is the strongest complete CNC milling machine you can get before the price rises sharply. The cost between the mill and the controller is $2600. I spent another $1.2 to $15,000 to build a shell with flood coolant to cut the metal reliably and well. I have at least $1,000 worth of end mills, and maybe $1,000 worth of fixture plates, fixtures, and accessories. This is more than 6000 dollars. Of course, it is more powerful than a $300 3D printer. It is absurd to imply that this is not well reflected on the 3D printer.
I haven't tried aluminum, but others have tried. His machine is almost the same as mine, but he upgraded the spindle to a 1kW water-cooled model. He can machine aluminum and other soft metals with a low feed rate (IIRC 120-240 mm/min), 20k RPM and a cutting depth of no more than 0.3 mm. Instead of using overflow coolant, he uses vacuum to remove chips. I think I might be able to do the same thing with DoC at a lower feed rate. So I would rather make a mold to cast parts with wax, and then use the lost wax method. It's like this in industry...
Consider that I actually processed aluminum once. I accidentally hit the bed, but the tool survived... ;)
Well, I have to say that you have a good way of growing up. I have been engaged in machine work, hobbies and professions for longer than you have been alive. My introduction to 3D printing (FDM) was in the mid-1990s.
You have been hiding and weaving here. Your initial statement is that 3d printing is exaggerated (opinion, but I tend to agree, especially at the consumer/hobby level, and has nothing to do with the article), 3d printing has nothing to do with milling machines (obviously wrong and irrelevant), 3d The materials that can be used by the printer are limited (controversial in general, but it is true at the hobby price point, not related to the original article), 3d printers are slow (controversial-it depends on the material, design and intent, and again, no Related), and most people use them for manual or CNC tools that might be misleading, irrelevant, and just stupid, because 3D printers are CNC tools. )
Please take a break. We all know that consumer FDM 3D printers are not in the same alliance with Haas, which is worth $100,000. But they can still do things that Haas can't do, and there is no comparison, because Haas is 100,000 US dollars, and consumer-grade machines are 300 US dollars.
Yes, these machines are used to make a lot of trinkets. so? You need to start somewhere. Ten years ago, consumer-grade machines were really not up to the task of parts with good, predictable mechanical properties. Now, they match the user's material characteristics and skills. Even a unit of $300 (for example, the parts made by my low-end imported products are in some very dense manufacturing environments)
real. let it go. You did not impress anyone.
As several others have said (more politely): Okay, whatever
Actually resolve your statement: 1) Yes, excessive hype, but this is not a reason to accept or reject the technology. The logical fallacy of happiness. 2) No. This is definitely not the case. This is why even though I have a complete mechanical workshop, I also have and use FDM printers. 3) Not true. It depends on how much you are willing to pay, just like using a CNC milling machine. I can pay $2,000 for a desktop small 3-axis milling machine, or $150,000 for a Haas machining center. 4) Similarly, it depends on the situation and the machine being compared. Apple to abstract algebra comparison, here. 5) The second logical fallacy of happiness. Most people use cars to do things they can do with bicycles or on foot.
I have a CNC machine and a 3D printer. CNC is something that needs constant observation. You missed the fixture from your list, which is by far the biggest pain. I can only do a calculation to get my milling speed, and it does not help me try to fix things and level them. In addition, there are many practical shapes that my 3-axis CNC cannot complete, and there is no excellent open source software for> 3-axis CAM. I will continue to use my 3D printer happily under reasonable circumstances, thank you.
I used my 3D printer to make fixtures for my CNC milling machine because it happened. If you are not digging out a lot of things, but just need to cut some things, such as out-of-control PLA aluminum castings that need to face fly-cutting, a large 3D printing fixture with the opposite shape of the workpiece will definitely save a lot of time. I recently made a custom thermostat housing for an antique car, using a standard clamp or vise to fix something with a hemispherical bottom, and the hose attachment sticks out at a strange angle, which would be a terrible task. Printing two 3d shells clamped on either side and installed in a vise is simple and hard enough to remove 0.1 mm from the bottom to get a good surface for the water gasket.
I think, but I cast an entrance for my Austin (The Lost PLA), and no cnc can cut it with a printer that includes about $500. So I don’t think there is a need for CNC milling machines. Not to mention the time cost required for multiple processes for more complex shapes.
Also, wood? What's the use? You mean cnc router?
Can't you get spare parts? I have never written that 3D printers are useless or broken. They just don’t suit me, at least not right now...
Yes, wood. Yes, a 3-axis CNC milling machine. Today I made a soap mold from a piece of alder fence. Most of the things I do are 2D and 2.5D cutting and engraving, and some engraving. But sometimes I do a 3D sculpture...
"Can't you get spare parts?"
Maybe [Red-Fathom] is making a streamlined sensor, or adding a blower/compressor, turbocharger or fuel injector to the engine of the original carburetor...
Or they do short-term production. Create and sell spare parts. :)
For 67 Austin fx4, they did not upgrade, and the air intake bolt of the exhaust has "hot spots" to heat a single tiny Zenith carburetor. It is flooded.
Seeing that I did not use 3d carving, but the law of hammer.
I have a CNC milling machine. I want to see you milling a motor head with internal water channels. I divided it into multiple pieces and printed it out in 3D, put it in a core of baking sand, sealed it up, coated it with Plasticast, burned the 3D printed form, and then cast the head. Then I put it on my CNC milling machine and cleaned the sealing surface. (If you are willing to accept welding on the side panels later, you can mill some internal water channels and then deal with the geometric changes caused by welding, but this is not easy, and you cannot get a good coolant flow.) I don't have the money to buy Haas. Therefore, my 3D printer can make complex shapes much faster than my CNC milling machine because I have to make multiple fixtures to hold the workpiece firmly. The total price of the two 3D printers is lower than the factory replacement price for servo motors and amplifiers.
I am actually thinking of making my own model internal combustion engine, or at least a few steam engines of different configurations. But I cannot cast metal in an apartment building. Some things about fire safety...
You can probably do it once.
3D printers and CNC machines complement each other. CNC is more complex and time consuming, but you get parts with better finish and strength. Noise and dust will also close that part of the house when in use. 3D printers are easier to use and require much less operating time. Almost set and forget.
For products with a more professional appearance, I will use CNC to make external parts and a 3D printer to make internal parts. 3D printing is also very suitable for testing the fit and appearance of CNC parts before you spend time and energy on processing. Both machines are good, but I don't think either of them can replace the other.
I don't think it has been overhyped. no longer. This is true, but the market has identified well-defined feature sets, use cases, and reliable manufacturers.
In the beginning, it is difficult to determine whether the manufacturer you purchased the printer will still be in business the following year. This is important for all kinds of old-school ideas that try to seize part of the market and bring the same s**t as the inkjet market-closed source drivers, locked filaments, etc. Most of these companies are dead and forgotten, and I don’t think no one will miss them. Yes, I bought the XYZprinting printer by mistake as my hobby. It was great at first, but filament locks were unacceptable to me because they started to fade after the hype, so I couldn't even easily buy their stupid RFID tag spools. Yes, there are some "techniques" that can change this, but in fact they are not feasible and it is very difficult. So I took it apart and threw the injection-molded shell into the recycling bin. There were a bunch of beautiful motion control drill bits inside. As long as I had...er...3D printer, I could make anything.
So I bought a Marriott i3, which is my main force for 3 years. I upgraded and upgraded it until there was almost nothing in the original. This is the ultimate goal of 3D printers-with a large amount of open work and sharing in the community, they are almost never out of date and can print their own upgraded parts.
I started printing stupid dogs and Thingiverse things, and eventually I designed my own things, and having a device that turns my CAD creations into real objects, it feels like magic. I started designing things for my friends, everything from new parts and cookie cutters to stupid substitutes. You don’t know how surprised you will be when someone breaks a stupid clip on a TV remote or a clothes dryer and says "Oh, it’s okay, give it to me, I’ll print you a new one on the weekend" . In terms of being able to replace small plastic parts for more expensive items, I saved many times the value of my printer.
When you have a 3D printer and are happy to help others, you will never lack friends. Especially for other hobbies like drone racing, they often break small plastic parts, and manufacturers charge unreasonable replacement fees because they would rather you buy a brand new one.
It doesn't make sense for someone to set up the entire supply and logistics chain for a small item, and 3D printers have changed the rules of the game.
I don't buy a raspberry pi shell, I can get one from my printer bed in about 2 hours. I don't have to worry about trying to find a small amount of metal spacers (this is very difficult in many places!) or cutting off my thumb in the CNC or using a large bending jig and anything just to better support my iPhone.
CNC can do the same things as 3D printers, which is absolutely untrue. It cannot create holes. It cannot solve complex overhangs or internal details. Unless you have a 5-axis CNC for more than $6,000, you can't even handle some simple functions, and a $200 3D printer can do it in strides with less power consumption, noise, chaos, and space.
You almost convinced me to buy a 3D printer. Unfortunately, they are still a bit expensive here, and they are also expensive to operate. In fact, if you need a single custom part or prototype, I think they are great. I did this twice, ordering from a manufacturer that runs a business with a 3D printer...
As for what you can do with 3D printing, it can be done by subtractive processing and additives. The way you do this is a bit complicated: you divide your design into pieces that can actually be processed on a machine you own, and then you assemble them into one part. If you don't add a lot of supports or lattice fillers, you can't actually use the FDM printer to make hands-on and internal blank spaces. You can only be like me. Use FDM. That is…
With the right filament, cooling, and very good extruder (I use the best Flexion currently), you can get impressive bridges and internal features. Indeed, you cannot drape 90 degrees on the edge, but you can do it with a CNC and the right drill.
But I have never seen CNC complete the bench boat at one time without changing tools or fixtures ;)
All of these are suitable tools for this job, but we have a lot of weirdos who enjoy 3D printing just for the sake of 3D printing.
Hey, I want an adapter bracket to push the AM4 cooler onto the AM3 board. I don’t have a board or radiator on hand (in lunch break during work). I checked it and the first one that popped up was the 3D printed model.
When I got home, I flattened the printed net proportionally and made it with 3 mm acrylic, because it only has 2 brackets that are almost L and each bracket has 4 holes. It took a full 20 minutes. Until the edges are polished well. According to cura, it takes at least 2 hours to print out
6. There are many "clubs" or technical associations that can use high-quality 3D printers (for a small fee/membership).
There is no one near me, AFAIK. The nearest hacker space or something like that is about 50 kilometers away from my town...
I ordered 3D printed parts three times. The first part was the flawed design, and it didn't last long. Before I redesigned it, I had already got the project I was trying to build from scratch. The second part is actually my first bad CNC's new X axis assembly. Original is also 3D printed, so I thought "Why not?" The first print was beautiful and very smooth. I paid $25 and got the smoothing for free. It turned out that the person who made it messed up the scale in one direction, so all the round holes are oval. I discovered this after knocking on the linear bearing. The second attempt with a different manufacturer worked better...
Irrelevant. Just because you don’t use them doesn’t mean they won’t become waste for millions of people. In addition, your comments are inaccurate and misleading. I have a fadal 3016 and a $350 fdm printer cr-10s. They all have their place.
1. I agree that the 3D printing trend is exaggerated for ordinary people. These are not "Star Trek Replicators", they are machine tools
2. I can point out a large number of shapes that cannot be achieved with a CNC milling machine, and can display supporting documents from industrial sources. The simplest is the complex geometry in the cavity of a single part.
3. Most *hobbyists* have limited materials for 3D printers. The industry is not. Many metals have been printed, including stainless steel and ceramics and other metals that cannot be achieved by CNC milling machines.
4. CNC milling machines (and lathes) are also very slow, requiring great attention to detail when planning the sequence of steps required for a given part and tool replacement. There are also issues with pre-setting and post-production operations. Most of them also require attention to prevent "problems", because some failures can be more catastrophic and destructive.
5. Interestingly, when engineers have been using 3D printing for rapid prototyping for decades, you cited "most people"... This is mainly due to the time and difficulty between iterations of the aforementioned standard processing practices.
Considering that the technology has actually existed for decades, most of the technology is fully mature... The difference involved is to reduce the price of an industrial-grade machine from $10,000 to $50,000 to the hobbyist market... This is it It's still quite new...this is where new markets are opening up...and the features it provides are why it continues to grow. Obtaining a good quality manual milling machine or lathe is still an expensive job, not to mention the full CNC variant, and the time and learning required to operate the equipment.
Finally, this is another machine tool added to the existing equipment library... It has the same advantages and disadvantages as milling machines or lathes (CNC or other methods), and each has a niche it was created to fill.
Amen. I often wonder why I might need a 3D printer. Either I am not so creative, or I can make a part in other ways. In any case, I am more "electrical" rather than "mechanical". If I need something substantial, a small milling machine, a small lathe and some other tools can solve the problem.
We have a few old printers in Makerspace-members can take them home to repair or take parts to build a new printer, but no one takes them. They still prefer to buy only cheap Chinese printers. As more and more members buy their own machines to use at home, printer usage in the makerspace drops.
If you have an old controller, a few steppers, and a few pulleys, you can make a sand table at any time. There are only two motors and two stoppers, so wiring and configuration are very simple. The simplest 3D printer controller can easily complete the task of drawing patterns in the sand. You don't have to write software to generate the pattern-it is already done and ready to use. Sandify generates gorgeous geometric patterns. If you are a fan of RPi, please don't miss Mike Dubno's advanced sandbox software.
https://github.com/dubnom/sandtable https://sandify.org/
We still see the massive use of 3D printers in the hacker space. I believe this is because, in this case, the maintenance of the printer can be handled by people (some of us, anyway) who know what everyone needs and who can "use" them.
Most people have absolutely no interest in maintaining machines. Can't say how I blame them; this may be the right kind of pain.
My hacking space is bought in large quantities in printrbot, and they are all unsupported and outdated now. I think there are 15 in their mobile hacker space.
We have a few broken printers in Makerspace, and I can’t send them out. No one wants to repair old printers, and few people are interested in designing or building their own printers using parts of old printers. As more and more people buy their own machines, the printer usage rate in the makerspace is getting lower and lower.
If you have several steppers, several pulleys, a controller board and a power supply, you can easily build a sandbox. The software used to generate the patterns is easily available (Excellent RPi software by Sandify and Mike Dubno). Since there are only two motors and two stoppers (no fans, thermistors or heaters), wiring and configuration are very simple, and even a basic controller can handle drawing two-dimensional patterns from gcode.
If no one is excited about steppers and drivers, etc., you will encounter some very crappy hackers. Use it as is.
I currently have a project that can use 2 or 3 crashes. Too bad, there is no maker space for 4 hours here
Isn't this balanced with all dot matrix printers that have been converted or unsuccessfully converted to 3D printers (and xy plotters)?
I remember when Don Lancaster talked about "Santa Claus Machine", his idea at the beginning was vague, but now he knows the idea of 3D printing very well. I think there are even some architectural articles in Radio Electronics or similar fields that contain basic printers made from dot matrix printers.
It all starts with expensive, complicated and heavy. The demand leads to a simplified structure and better specifications, which brings in more buyers and thus further simplification. In the beginning, few people bought it. When the price dropped a lot, they came in. Things became simpler, maybe different.
In November 1980, my friend bought a VCR, which was still expensive and big. But apart from price and size, it has never changed much.
Few people buy Altair 8800, but the demand is enough for others to follow up. Each iteration brought more buyers, but the biggest wave came later. Many people use their mobile phones as computers, and their "needs" vary greatly. They actually waited until what they wanted finally arrived
"A friend bought a VCR in November 1980. It is still expensive and large. But apart from the price and size, it has never changed much."
I still don't get my own. Hope this year. Does anyone have an old printer to uninstall?
I will support it. If anyone has it, I will accept it.
Why not buy a cheap laser and turn it into an engraving machine? This seems to be a simple and useful conversion...
Yes, if I let them sit next to them, they would use bolts, fasten zippers, and even stick various things with tape. Like pen, laser, dremel, "earwax" range, spot welder, Heath Robinson/Rube Goldberg arc deposition equipment...
In addition, although they still push plastics, I might have a few days "massively parallel" production of some commonly useful hardware parts, brackets, knobs, brackets, clips, and fill up a few small garbage bins.
A mobile phone for positioning the MIG welding machine jumped up slightly, and the cooling fan cable was hung on a solenoid, pushing the trigger of the MIG welding gun, just saying'.
My retina is just reading that.
I just want to say that I am relatively new to using the 3D printer I own and can run mills and lathes. But having said that, these machines are great, and imagination is your only limit. It's the same as a 3d printer, but printing your own 55-inch wingspan remote control plane on a 3d printer is too bad, in my opinion, it is even incomparable. My view of it is just constantly pushing the limits. The only machine that can rebuild itself is a combination drill-milling machine and a product like peel. I think the printer can almost do the same thing. This is what I want to say.
I own a commercial prefabricated 3-D printer, and I will soon submit it as a Hackaday project because it has become too expensive to maintain it with the manufacturer's parts. I originally paid AU$1500 in 2016 as an educational experience. It is very well done and it is worth my initial investment in me.
However, I had to choose between continuing to purchase expensive parts and repairs from overseas, or buying cheap Chinese imitations for domestic use. I have recently built an Anet-A8 for our men's shed (mainly for the maker space of the old buffer zone) and am very satisfied with what I have learned from building and running it. It's AM8 now!
So in the end, in order to solve the problem of e-waste and learn from my early expensive machines to the greatest extent, I decided to use its proprietary software, related hardware, etc. to strip off electronic equipment. I have been using eBay Bits, RAMPS 1.4, Marlin to rebuild It 2, OctoPrint and Cura, get rid of the classic combination of the original company (which abandoned us in Australia). It is now 100% maintainable and uses very affordable eBay parts. I learned something amazing from this hard work from scratch.
I hope it will soon become a hacker day article to inspire others to use new electronic products and open source software to upgrade proprietary 3D printers that are not economically viable. The underlying mechanical technology is indeed very good. This is a great hacking experience! !
Why is it incremental? I bought (launched) DeltaMaker, and at the time others were complaining about all the ways their 3D printer could not work, it just started and immediately produced usable prints. I specially purchased a delta because it did not suffer from a problem encountered by all other designs at the time, that is, an over-constrained axis would cause binding or tilt. That is a very hard machine. Although it took them a long time to pass, when they were finished, they sent a very beautiful product.
My AnyCubic Delta is still producing usable shells and connectors.
https://youtu.be/fwMM4TX-iPk
That is also my experience. One member of the Makerspace donated it. After years of use, it was only a PSU failure (after four years of uptime). I think the only maintenance for it is that the fan clamped the screwdriver for a while.
Same Here. The only working printer in our space is deltas!
Like everyone else, we have a shelf full of Descartes' corpses. And there are not enough other sports to use all the guts we can gain from it.
The amateur 3D printers displayed on Hackaday are usually cheap plastic boxes, panels or some fragile small parts. There is nothing that cannot be done by hand or a lathe/milling machine.
It's not that 3D printing is hype. I have seen what companies in the medical field do very impressively. But they will not use old printers worth $200.00 or trash found in their parents' basement to achieve their goals.
As for those abandoned 3D printers, who would want one of those terrible time slots in the name of God? They were abandoned by fans for a reason. They don't work, they catch fire easily, etc. I have read enough articles on Hackaday to keep away from this fashion.
Maybe in another ten years, as printers get better, they will be useful. Even so, I will stay away from cheap ones. They are cheap for a reason, which means cutting corners. It boils down to the same reason, there are more Volkswagen Golf on the road than Hugo-quality and design.
Yesterday I printed a heald hook for my wife's new loom and a knob for the joystick of my neighbor's electric wheelchair. I can do these two things in my metal shop. However, my wife tried the heald hook and said "Oh, wait, I need a deeper hook so that the yarn won't come out", and the neighbor said, "This is the size of the old knob, but my hand can hold it. When I was young, could you make it bigger?" After half an hour, in each case, I had a revised version they liked. Then I milled out a hook out of stainless steel and cut out a knob out of aluminum on a lathe. They were all the right size. PLA is cheaper than tools for cutting stainless steel, and my cnc 3d printer takes less time to produce prototypes than my manual lathe. The girl we looked after over the weekend must be very happy to bring home the 300mm Yoda 3D print, and apparently thinks it is the coolest thing she has ever seen. I don't know how long it will take to cut a 300mm aluminum cube on my CNC machine, because it is impossible for me to do this for a child's toy. Practicality, entertainment and satisfaction. As the owner of a good machine factory, I really haven't received widespread criticism of 3D printers. I have an average of 2 hours of printing time per day because there are too many fixtures, enclosures, prototypes and fixtures that I need, 90% of which do not need to be metal.
well said. Different machines have different advantages and disadvantages.
I also have a manual desktop milling machine, which I changed to CNC, and a delta 3d printer I made. In general, they are very complementary tools, and suggesting a better or worse tool misses the point because they are different tools.
For example, which is better, a chisel or a saw?
I think a valid criticism is not the machine itself, but the many users. For over-enthusiastic new users, it is common to try to print everything, including parts that can be better cut from available materials. See how many "drones" on Thingiverse are clones of fiberglass/carbon designs, using similar sizes, etc.
Generally speaking, if you want to print a piece of material or a uniform tube, you are doing it wrong. Cut your pipes with a hacksaw, and then print the brackets to connect them together and print out strangely shaped parts that cannot be used in other ways.
Also, trying to print big things into multiple pieces and glue them together is always a bit silly for me.
3D printer complaints are similar to VR complaints. There are a bunch of unnecessary VR parts somewhere.
Many printers have good parts and can provide good inspiration for strange printers. Willing to take the printer to a good home in Eastern Germany. Email me. :)
julia.longtin@gmail.com, if you have trouble finding it. I make strange machines!
Oh, come on. Too many of you have not been children in a long time.
Claw machine
There are no Toys "R" Us™ children in the audience. Jeffrey will be disappointed.
What can you do with your old 3d printer? Upgrade it to add new features! Improve it instead of buying a new one to replace it. Shouldn't you be a maker?
I also have my 2014 Mixshop Kossel(ish) delta kit printer. It is enough to print your own upgrade. I only used about 5 kg of filament, but those are 83 different objects. Mainly practical things...a bunch of project casings, some soap boxes (any commercial soap box really fits any sink for anyone?), just a bunch of gadgets and replacement parts. About half of them turned out well and are still in use. I would definitely say it was a great trip...PLA is really a kind of junk material, and FDM is a huge hacker, but these things I made are *useful*. In most cases, as an ordinary consumer, it is impossible for me to buy these things... Many of them may be ground out of wood or steel, but I lack a collection of woodworking tools and skills.
In any case, I can't imagine throwing away that printer. It's not that it does not produce some waste, although I have thrown away most of the plastic parts so far. But I already have a replacement hot end waiting to be installed, and I kind of hate RAMPS, so I have been eager to use a smoothie board. But stepper motors, a little bit of hardware, and long extruded aluminum parts, I wouldn’t be surprised if I were still using them ten years later.
On the other hand, I like a usable product, so one day I can see myself being attracted by a new printer worth $300. It’s just that the number of my printers is known so far, which is where the real value lies. I have to learn something new!
"On the other hand, I like an effective product, so one day I can see myself being attracted by a new printer worth $300. It's just that the number of my printers is known so far, which is the real one. The value is. I have to learn something new!"
Better development* [sic] You know, better development than you didn’t know!
Yes, there are really no new hot spots. Commodity printers only find thermoplastic through the tip...so unless it moves the plastic in some way to make *your* work better, you may have got the best settings!
According to my experience, maintaining these things is the biggest problem for the printer. Therefore, printers that you can easily use are far better than printers that you might not use.
To be sure, the soap dish should not be "part of the sink". There are plans for people who don’t have a sink to sit on the counter with a bar of soap, or don’t want to clean up the mess from the sunken bar of soap.
"Old" 3D printer? What? I still have my original 3D printer. It has been transformed by the "Ship of Theseus", and there are few original printers left, but its parts are kept as spare parts or reused for other projects. Why do you want to get rid of the 3D printer (even think it is outdated, or even think that throwing it away is an option)? You have a 3D printer! Upgrade rigidity. Upgrade the control system. Use zero-backlash drive screws instead. Add another head. experiment! You have this amazing tool. For Pete's sake, please use it!
Bring a microscope to make PCB inspection tools.
Oh no. Authors should definitely put their old, quirky plywood shell printers on the porch and put an ad in the craigs or upcycle so that they can be towed away and recycled "appropriately". Obviously unusable garbage. Don't overemphasize ol and save a few steps to the trash can. This saves a few minutes of time to clean up the garbage.
Simple: buy a too expensive printer and you dare not replace it. (Yes, it will be a rant)
We have an Ultimaker 3, which used to be a great machine. Low maintenance and always effective. Again, close to 6,000 euros, you would expect it, wouldn't you?
Sadly, this money can only give you a little more than a year of fun. Then, even after oiling/lubricating everything, replacing the build plate, replacing the sensor plate, and calibrating twice, the automatic leveling fails about 1/3 of the time. Ultimaker will tell you to try again. It will work the second or third time, yes. But troubleshooting is not the purpose of our purchase of this machine. Annoying, but there are no real problems yet.
Then, after a few months, it will stop updating. It will simply refuse to update its firmware from USB. Therefore, you contact them again and get a complete program manual for digging the motherboard and refreshing it again. Fun time, now it will not be updated, and the screen decided to use hashtags instead of some random characters.
Oops, non-update is a bug of Ultimaker. It will not update via USB, but the Internet update works fine. The entire flashing process? No, it will never help anyway. Screen? Yes, you do this by flashing the machine yourself. So now we are using laptops to share our company's wifi via Ethernet to update the damn thing, until they finally fix the bug introduced by the "cloud" feature that we never want and will never use. (Fun fact: they actually canceled our ability to monitor the temperature in Cura to introduce it. Now we are stuck on some slow websites provided by the printer, which won't tell you anything.)
do not you know. One month later, it started randomly stopping intermediate printing because it could not communicate with the hot end. The I2C connection seems to be messed up somewhere, but even after two new print cores and a new hot-end assembly (the only way to purchase a replacement cable), the VAT "consumables" worth 500 euros is not in the warranty Within the scope, it is still nonsense to go out about once a day. Because, so far, we have had it for two years, this is our problem.
The 3D printer we bought costs less than Ultimaker's replacement "consumables" and is now printing larger prints because it can manage to keep running for more than 4 hours. For small fonts, we still use Ultimaker because it is too expensive to throw away.
But trust me, on the day that thing finally gets rid of its ghost, I will buy it a beautiful new axe or bat to get in touch with it until there is no e-waste.
Most of the comments seem to be distracted by the idea that the printer is always a printer-you have a bunch of stepper motors, controllers, power supplies, driving gears/screws. Take it all apart, pile it up in a pile, and challenge yourself to build something *not* a printer (or give it to the robot team at the local school).
Of course in the UK, but I hope that the whole world is the same. Youth groups are taking a lot of measures to teach STEM within their organizations. Based on my experience (like a lecturer at Sea Cadet Corps), I welcome any donated 3D printer (although my organization is lucky) to show our engineering courses how this technology works. To clarify, I didn't ask for anything myself, but some people would still appreciate it very much.
What are you talking about now? Give it to me, I would be happy to upgrade all these stepper motors!
When the contribution of the 3-D printer design is equal to the design of the CNC project on the Internet, I will accept that we are close to comparing oranges with oranges. Nothing can stimulate the muscles of CNC boys more than 3D printed articles. Talk about jealousy. Do your own thing and enjoy it. No matter what machine you are lucky enough to own. Stop bragging, just get hackers.
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